Seòmar agus comataidhean

I, too, agree, convener.

There are no salmon farms in Dumfries and Galloway, but a lot of work is being done to look at how wild salmon move. Galloway Fisheries Trust is one of the groups that are doing a lot of really good research. The same applies to the River Tweed. Is that part of the engagement with local groups and local people that you are talking about?using their research and evidence to help to inform how we can address the issue of sea lice on wild salmon?

You talked about the 12 pressures. Lots of variables can impact the health of farmed salmon and wild salmon, such as water temperature and algae blooms. There is no one solution to how we can address the issue of sea lice on wild salmon. In relation to the framework, does further work need to be done to strengthen any regulations?

I am not here as often as Karen Adam is, so I would like to clarify: do we need a minister or do we need an official, if it is really just to clarify the information so that we can proceed and make a better-informed decision?

My questions have been covered, convener.

Good morning to you all.

Jill Barber just mentioned sea lice. I am interested in sea lice interactions with the wild salmon population. I have loads of pages open here, because a lot of work is being done by the North Atlantic Salmon Conservation Organization. The document that I have in front of me is a Government document that talks about the impacts of lice from fish farms on wild Scottish sea trout and salmon. There is lots of scientific information here about the impacts of sea lice on sea trout and wild salmon. Lots of modelling has been done, as well as observational and experimental studies. It is quite comprehensive, and work is being taken forward to look at the impacts of sea lice on wild salmon.

I am interested in hearing about what progress has been made to look at how we manage the impact of farmed salmon lice on the wild salmon population.

The words “co-design” and “co-production” are often used interchangeably but, in this case, we are pursuing co-design. Just yesterday, I had a conversation with an elected member who used “co-production” and “co-design” as if they were interchangeable. I am interested to hear about what the co-design process really is and how distinct it is from co-production.

I will pick up on some of the issues about engaging with COSLA and the unions. We took evidence from the Scottish Partnership for Palliative Care and heard that

“The national care service is a real opportunity to be part of improving people’s experiences of living with serious illness, and of dying and bereavement.”—[Official Report, Health, Social Care and Sport Committee, 13 December 2022; c 5.]

Age Scotland said that the Scottish Government has made it clear that there is a commitment to involving people with lived experience.

I would be interested in hearing about engagement with unions. I read a statement from Unison that said that

“the bill leaves profiteering at the heart of care”

and I know that there are concerns about employment and pensions. In contrast with the position of the Health and Social Care Alliance Scotland, the Scottish Partnership for Palliative Care and Age Scotland, who all welcome the bill, others have concerns and may feel that they need to have a voice. Can you speak about that, minister?

I have one final question on this wee section. Things such as the regional forums will help to identify the differences that you described, such as differences in pay. As a former nurse educator, I am interested in support for career pathways and career progression, and I think that a national standard approach would give more weight to career pathways for social workers and carers. Will the forums and the plans for regional approaches help to determine that a standardised approach to education will be part of the national aspect?

We need people to be empowered to understand that they will be part of the co-design process and that the bill is a framework that we will build on. Is that what we are asking people to believe and trust—that they will be part of the co-design?