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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 31 January 2026
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Displaying 1955 contributions

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Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

I give the floor to Mr Simpson.

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

We have a small bit of time left, although not too much. We have covered quite a lot of ground, but I will ask just a few additional questions, Auditor General, if that is okay.

The most obvious point to make is that the issue of delayed discharges has been flagged by Audit Scotland for over 20 years. My briefing says that it was originally brought to the attention of a previous iteration of this committee, and Parliament, in 2001. Two decades have passed, yet here we are, looking at your latest report. It is clear that, while we are seeing some improvement in some health boards, it is still a massive issue. It is still costing the NHS £1 million a day, and tens—if not hundreds—of thousands of people are still affected by it.

I cannot get my head around how on earth, after two decades of flagging the issue to Government, we are still in this mess. It is not necessarily for you to answer, or to be accountable, for decisions that Government has or has not made over the years. However, in your view, what is the reason why it is still such a big issue?

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

I have to say that those three themes—better and more data, clearer implementation and planning, and more collaboration on what does and does not work well and how best practice is shared—appear in pretty much every report that you have ever written since I joined the committee. Why are those such common issues across all areas of policy in Government? Those themes are recurring—every report says the same thing.

11:30

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

That is a good point. If someone is medically fit to leave hospital and the doctors do not want them there, and if the patient does not want to be there and their families do not want them to be there but there is clearly a blockage, what happens next for that patient?

Mr Simpson went into some detail about the variety of issues that are causing the blockages. Are you saying that, ultimately, these are all social care issues and so they are community-based problems that are the responsibility of, for example, IJBs, local councils, the third sector and care homes? There are so many other partners involved in unblocking this that it is hard to see how it will all join up so that we can finally crack this nut.

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

That is helpful. We can pose those questions to the Government in due course, based on your helpful feedback.

I also want to look briefly at social care. Adam, I was quite taken by your example. It is one of many such examples that members hear, particularly from our casework, of people being unable to access care packages. You mentioned the availability of staff. That is certainly an issue, but there are also issues around the amount of funding that is available at the local level, in councils, for packages. We have heard that, if someone is unlucky enough to be a patient between January and March, and if the money has run out, they are more likely to be stuck in hospital until the beginning of the new financial year, when the money is unlocked. Is there any evidence of that happening?

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

Are you confident that there is still a national charge towards meeting this objective?

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

Finally, Auditor General, you have made a number of recommendations in your report, which we can read in black and white—or blue and blue, as they are. What is your overarching message that will prevent us from sitting here, discussing this in 20 years’ time?

I—or you, Auditor General—might not be sitting here in 20 years’ time, but there is a shared desire that the issue does not go on for another 20 years, because we cannot afford the financial or human cost of its doing so. What is your overarching message for stakeholders to take heed of, so that we can avoid that being the case?

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

Welcome back, committee members. Agenda item 3 is consideration of the report, “Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and the briefing, “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”, which have been submitted to us by Audit Scotland.

I welcome our witnesses: Stephen Boyle, the Auditor General for Scotland; Carol Calder, audit director at Audit Scotland; and Adam—forgive me; perhaps you can help me out with the pronunciation of your surname.

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

Do you think that delayed discharges can ever be eliminated, or is that an impossible ambition? Delayed discharges can be reduced, for sure; there is clearly evidence that that can happen when approaches work well. Carol Calder spoke about some examples of good practice. Nevertheless, while the level of delayed discharges can be reduced, they can never truly be eliminated. Are we, therefore, just setting ourselves up for failure in trying to fix the problem? Is it simply baked into the processes of the entire health and social care system?

Public Audit Committee [Draft]

“Delayed discharges: A symptom of the challenges facing health and social care” and “Community health and social care: Performance 2025”

Meeting date: 21 January 2026

Jamie Greene

Yes—that has been well iterated in your report.