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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 21 December 2024
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Displaying 1309 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

What are your main concerns about the bill, if any?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

We will come back to the issue of prisoner release.

I come back to time limits, because that is a technical matter and the bill deals with it on a technical level. I think that there is a general understanding of why there has been an extension of statutory time limits, both for trials and, in the more direct case, remand, which has a direct effect on the prison estate. However, the extensions of the time limits for remand are quite stark: a jump from 80 days to 260, from 110 days to 290, and from 140 to 320, which is nearly a year. Those are marked differences. The original extensions were emergency measures and they were temporary. The bill seeks to retain them and make them on-going features of the justice system. Do you have a view on that? Is it right that those extensions are in the bill? Do we still need them, given that the First Minister announced yesterday that the majority of Covid restrictions would be dropped next month? Why should the extensions become permanent features of our justice system?

11:30  

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

That is great.

My second question on that concerns the fact that some people think that, for some trials, even 18 months is ambitious, albeit that that is an extended time limit. We have just heard examples of some trials that are already taking way beyond 18 months. If we assume that that is what is happening, the backlog is going to take four or five years—perhaps longer—to clear, given the volume of cases.

What are the main causes of the delays to trials? Do they involve the capacity in the system? On numerous occasions, the committee has asked the SCTS and the Crown Office whether they think that there is capacity in the system to deal with the backlog, or what more they might need to get through it more quickly.

Alternatively, do the delays simply involve the nature of the processes that we work with? Is it that, even with all the will in the world—if we doubled court capacity and the number of defence solicitors and Crown agents—we would still not get through it at the same rate as we would wish because of the inherent nature by which trials take place?

What are the main barriers to reducing the length of time that people are waiting? In other words, how do we clear that backlog quickly but also fairly, so that each party is given the absolute right to fairness throughout the process?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

What effect has the rather elongated extension to remand time had on the Scottish Prison Service? Do you have a view as to whether the measures seem necessary and proportionate enough to make them permanent features?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

I have a two-part question about early release.

As you know, short-term prisoners in Scotland must be released after serving half their sentence. Long-term prisoners may be released after serving half their sentence, subject to decisions by the Parole Board for Scotland. First, what do you think about that concept?

Secondly, the emergency provisions in the coronavirus legislation gave the Scottish Government the ability to release prisoners earlier than the mandatory time limits. The bill, as I said in my previous question, seeks to make those temporary provisions more permanent features of the justice system. Is that appropriate? Would you prefer the provisions not to be permanent in legislation? I think that we all agree that some good justice system reforms have come from the Covid pandemic; we have already talked about those. However, we might not want that provision to become a permanent feature of the system.

Perhaps Kate Wallace can start.

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

The question was about the ability to release people even earlier than halfway through their sentence. That was a temporary measure to deal with the public health emergency of the pandemic, but the bill will make the measure permanent. What is your view on that?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

Have there been any?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

I apologise, convener. I have been looking at our schedule of questions, and I have another question about prisoner release.

What Mr Purdie has said is very welcome, but can I double check that all prisoners are tested before they are released from prison, irrespective of whether their release is early, planned or due? Does that happen as a matter of course, or are they tested when they go into the community, as a general public health measure?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

Of course. I understand the implications of that.

Ms Medhurst, what were the criteria for coming to a decision about early release? I ask that not to look backwards, but because the bill that is before us means that the same situation could arise again. From what you said earlier, the criteria seemed to be largely to do with your ability to confine people in single-occupancy spaces, given the issue of population versus capacity. What criteria did you use for the early release of prisoners? Would you use the same criteria again? If not, what would be different?

Criminal Justice Committee

Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 23 February 2022

Jamie Greene

I guess that, from a practical point of view, the families of those in prisons will most likely want to know what the current status is of that prison, which would be helpful for them.

I turn to my other question. From the responses that we have had, there seems to be support for extending the instrument by six months. Why six months? Is that in keeping with what the Parliament is doing with coronavirus measures? If the Parliament is legislating to end coronavirus measures for the wider public, why is there still a need for them to be extended in this case? What is so different about the prison environment that you need to keep extending the powers by six months, while we are ending them or do not really see the need to extend them for that long? Do you think that you will be coming back in another six months, asking for the powers again? I know that we do not know what will happen with the virus, but the measures seem like an endless iteration of what were only just temporary powers two years ago.