Seòmar agus comataidhean

Someone once described Dumfries town centre to me as being a place where people used to go to the shops and maybe have a coffee, but now they go for a coffee and might go to the shops. Obviously, hospitality has taken a bigger chunk of our high streets. is the retail footprint in our high streets too big? Do we need to accept that the impact of digital shopping means that we reduce the retail footprint in our town centres?

I will follow up the points that Fiona Hyslop made.

The vast majority of freight is transported by road, and that is likely to continue. In the example that we have just been talking about—the transportation of goods from Scotland to Northern Ireland—there are no rail links at all from Cairnryan ferry port and none from the south to Stranraer, which is the nearest town. There is only a winding track from Glasgow.

The idea of a fixed link between Scotland and Northern Ireland has rightly been buried in Beaufort’s dyke in the Irish Sea. The reality is that no one ever complains about the ferries to Northern Ireland; the problem is the condition of the roads to get to the ferry ports in the first place—the A75 and the A77.

My first question is to Richard Ballantyne. When it comes to the transportation of goods from Scotland to Ireland, how reasonable is the option of rail freight? Do we just need to be realistic and accept that, without improvements to the A75 and the A77, a key Scottish ferry port will continue to lose business to Heysham, Fleetwood, Liverpool and Holyhead when it comes to transporting goods to Ireland?

I think that the figure that you used in your evidence to the review was that it would be £1 billion for the roads. I would take that any day for improvements in the south-west.

I will move on to another issue that is still relevant to trade between Scotland and Northern Ireland, particularly as the gateway to the Republic of Ireland, but that also has implications for trade with the rest of the EU. It is about possible customs changes from 1 January 2022. Some of the plans have been postponed until possibly the middle of next year, but others will go ahead. How significant will the impact of those changes be and how ready is Scotland to manage them? Do the witnesses have any comments on the unique challenges that we have regarding trade between Scotland and Northern Ireland?

I put the question to Robert Windsor first, as the British International Freight Association has published material on the customs changes that will take place in January 2022.

That is interesting. I put the same question to Bryan Hepburn of DFDS. Robert Windsor has just said that he has been working in this business for 45 years and even so he cannot get his head round some of the challenges. In your experience, are businesses such as yours ready for the possible changes that will come in on 1 January?

I put the same question to Kiran Fernandes. I appreciate that your research was focused on the impact of Covid—

Northern Ireland is a domestic market but, for obvious reasons, there are problems there. Have you experienced problems when it comes to exporting domestic products from Scotland to Northern Ireland?

I will put the same question to Marie Hendry. Is the Open University geared up? Are you making changes in your courses to meet skills shortages?

Good morning, panel. My question follows on from the point that Alexander Burnett made. In the context of oil and gas, in particular, there is a lot of focus on the immediate labour and skills shortages that we face, but we know, not least as a result of COP26 last week, that Governments will make decisions that mean that many people in existing jobs will lose those jobs.

We are told, “That’s fine, because we’ll have a just transition and people will simply move into the new green jobs.” However, the committee heard last week that, when it comes to delivering the just transition, there is no comprehensive understanding of what the jobs will be, never mind a proper map of the skills that will be needed to deliver it. Is that a fair criticism? I will put Chris Brodie on the spot with that question.

Is the work that we are doing being done with the necessary urgency, given the challenges that we face? The Government has a climate change plan, but that will change. Are we geared up and able to adapt so that we can do the planning that will be needed? Whose role is it do that? Will all the individual organisations here do their own work, or is something else needed to grab the issue and run with it in a comprehensive way?

That it is very helpful. I will ask Richard McClelland to come in. I will not ask any other questions, as I am conscious of the time. However, if Marie Hendry or Chris Brodie wants to come back in on what else policymakers can do to assist, they should feel free to do that.

I put the same question to Richard McClelland. You will be adapting the qualifications that you need for the sectors. Is there anything that we can do to assist in that? What work are you doing at the moment?