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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 14 October 2025
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Displaying 927 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 4 December 2024

Fulton MacGregor

Good morning. This is giving me flashbacks to stage 1 and the enormity of the decision. As you heard earlier, it is clear that victims groups feel that moving to the proposed 10 out of 15 would be worse for victims. That is a compelling case, but we have heard another compelling case from you that other systems work effectively with near unanimity. Where do you think the Government got that suggestion? From a lay perspective, it feels like—I am sure that when the Government speaks to us about this, it will tell me that I am totally wrong—it is trying to please both points of view but is running the risk of not satisfying anybody. What is the thinking behind that, from a legal point of view?

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 4 December 2024

Fulton MacGregor

To go back to Rona Mackay’s question, is it such a bad thing? Could such a set-up have really negative consequences, or could it work and be a fair justice system? Do you know what I am getting at?

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 4 December 2024

Fulton MacGregor

You said something earlier, Simon, about the comparison of the conviction rates in Scotland and England. In England, there is a “better”—I put that in inverted commas—conviction rate. Is there a risk of Scotland’s not having a similar rate? Could having unanimity lead to more convictions and alleviate the concerns of victims organisations?

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

That is fair enough.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

The committee is aware that the SPSO has some very poor Trustpilot scores and reviews, and those have been highlighted by a recent petitioner to the Parliament. Can you give us any indication of how the committee might get a fuller picture of what the public perception is? It is possibly a wee bit in contrast to your own submissions.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

I do not want to put you on the spot, but are you able to give a practical example of where the own-initiative power might be used?

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

That is really interesting. Thank you.

09:45  

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

Thanks very much. My next question is for Paul Blaker and Peter Stewart-Blacker. I think that you almost come at my earlier question in reverse. You refer to the high rate of complaints that have been upheld—they are, therefore, complaints that have gone through the SPSO’s investigation stage—and you suggest that that indicates that many public bodies are still “getting it wrong”. Could you elaborate your thinking on that?

10:45  

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

I thank all the witnesses for their evidence so far. Last year, before I was a member of the committee, the ombudsman told the committee:

“we see good complaints handling in the first instance.”—[Official Report, Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee, 5 December 2023; c 9.]

That was in relation to public bodies. Do you agree that that is one of the reasons why complaints are not fully progressed through every stage? Before you came to the meeting, I said that that is not what I, as an MSP, tend to see, but, given what the witnesses on the previous panel said, I am quite willing to accept that that might be because I see only people who are very unhappy and come to me for a bit of advice and support. However, my experience as an MSP does not back that up.

I will direct that question to Jan Savage, Adam Stachura and Fiona Collie, because my second question will probably be for Peter Stewart-Blacker and Paul Blaker, who can come in at that point.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Scottish Public Services Ombudsman

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Fulton MacGregor

I want to ask you something else before I bring in Fiona Collie. Is there an impact based on the scale of seriousness, if that is the right term? Is the ombudsman able to say with confidence that investigations by public bodies are, in the main, done well? Is there a seriousness scale? The cases that eventually come to me, as an MSP—I am sure that it is the same for the charities that are represented today—seem to be quite serious and complex. Is there an issue in that regard? Is it the case that public bodies deal with the less serious cases pretty well and quickly but that things become more difficult as you go up that scale?