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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 3 April 2025
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Displaying 1931 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

A variety of views have been expressed on that issue. Probably quite a general view that those who have given evidence to the committee have expressed is that the penalties that the bill sets out are not proportionate and will not act as enough of a deterrent. To give a bit of background, the fines are set at a level that broadly mirrors the penalties in relation to the register of persons holding a controlling interest in land. That also involves a maximum penalty of £5,000, albeit that the penalty is criminal rather than civil. The question always comes back to the point about balance and ensuring that the fine will have the desired effect and act as a deterrent, so we want to consider the committee’s views and any recommendations that members might have.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

I will bring in Andy Proudfoot.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

Yes, we are. The consultation on the crofting legislation was, I believe, published at the start of this year or towards the end of last year, with the intention that the bill will be introduced in the coming year, although the timetable is to be finalised. I think that that will help to address some of the key issues that have been identified through this committee and through previous iterations of the rural committee. A number of proposals have been made over a number of years. It is important that we are able to address some of the issues with crofting through that legislation before considering steps beyond that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

That is because we have to be specific about the intention of a public interest test. If what you are suggesting is that a broad provision on public interest be included in the bill, I do not know that we could implement that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

You made the point about only communities being able to buy land. I want to ensure that we are not mixing up the pre-notification process with the lotting proposals, which allow for more diverse ownership. I hope that I have been able to set out today the fact that we looked at those other options—I think that some of that information is also set out in the policy memorandum. The only way that we could feasibly introduce the public interest test was at the point of transfer, taking into account the various things that we have talked about today in relation to the aim of the test, which concerns the diversity of land supply. I touched on examples from elsewhere in relation to looking at that and potential tests for buyers. However, it is not possible for us to do that, and, as Andy Proudfoot outlined, it would actually be more restrictive. That is why we have taken this approach.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

Ultimately, the latter will allow more detailed engagement to take place to ensure that we get the model lease right in the first instance.

I will hand over to Fiona Leslie, who might be able to provide more information on that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

The proposals are based on consultation of small landholders. According to the agricultural census, there are around 59 small landholders in Scotland, and their preference was to be aligned more with the agricultural holdings legislation rather than to become crofts. Applications can already be made by the landowner to the Crofting Commission in the crofting counties, should they wish that to take place.

Fiona Leslie may have more detail as she has been involved in many of the immediate discussions that have taken place with small landowners.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

That discussion will be familiar to Rhoda Grant and me, particularly through the consideration of the Agriculture and Rural Communities (Scotland) Act 2024, which was passed before the summer last year. Definitions of “sustainable and regenerative agriculture” were raised during evidence sessions on that bill. That is why we set out as part of that bill, which is now an act, that we would bring forward a code of practice on sustainable and regenerative agriculture, because it includes a wide variety—a basket—of measures that can be used.

An awful lot of work is being undertaken on producing that code and the various iterations of consultation that have been under way before it is due to be published. I appreciate that there is no definitive definition of “sustainable and regenerative”, but that is the specific reason why. A basket of measures is included that can look different in different pieces of land and in different farming systems across Scotland. That is why we developed the term in the way that we did for the 2024 act and why we are taking the work forward in that way.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

We would have to consider whether it was necessary for the bill to refer to the code of practice. Again, that work is largely being taken forward through the agricultural reform programme.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 18 February 2025

Mairi Gougeon

That largely comes down to the engagement that took place with small landholders and how they wanted to proceed. The legislation needs to be modernised, but what we produced and proposed was largely based on small landholders’ suggestions.