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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 18 September 2025
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Displaying 3340 contributions

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Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the year to 31 March 2025 and Auditor’s Report on the Accounts

Meeting date: 23 June 2025

Richard Leonard

Good morning. I want to continue to look at your “year in figures” table and turn attention to the fees and expenses that are paid to external firms. You have, for a long time, operated a mixed-market approach to public audit in Scotland, so you outsource about a third of public audits to be carried out by private companies. We approved a budget for the last financial year of £7.7 million, but the table shows that the actual spend was almost £9.5 million. That is a rise of 21 per cent in one year, compared to the budget. Can you explain that?

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the year to 31 March 2025 and Auditor’s Report on the Accounts

Meeting date: 23 June 2025

Richard Leonard

Might you come back next year and share with us another quite big variance in the fees paid, compared to the budget that has been set?

Meeting of the Commission

“Quality of public audit in Scotland: Annual report 2024/25”

Meeting date: 23 June 2025

Richard Leonard

Before you bring in Owen Smith, can you expand not just on “late”—we all understand “late” and that there may be understandable reasons for lateness in the completion of an audit—but the expression “not making progress”? That is of much greater concern to me than audits being late.

Meeting of the Commission

“Quality of public audit in Scotland: Annual report 2024/25”

Meeting date: 23 June 2025

Richard Leonard

In paragraph 18 of the report, you refer to one outlier public body, which has not had its audit for the financial year 2022-23 completed and, therefore, not had one completed for 2023-24 and, therefore, not had one completed for 2024-25. Again, that rings alarm bells with me, both as convener of the Public Audit Committee and as a member of the commission. In the end, this is about public money. It is about assurance for that body, and the good governance of that body. I do not know how big that particular organisation is, but nonetheless we are talking about whether a proper audit of public money is being undertaken.

Meeting of the Commission

“Quality of public audit in Scotland: Annual report 2024/25”

Meeting date: 23 June 2025

Richard Leonard

Excellent.

Meeting of the Commission

“Quality of public audit in Scotland: Annual report 2024/25”

Meeting date: 23 June 2025

Richard Leonard

But they are not like health and safety inspectors, who turn up unannounced, are they? I would expect that an audit is a planned operation between the public body that is being audited and the auditor—whether they are internal or from an external firm—who is carrying out the audit.

Public Audit Committee

“General practice: Progress since the 2018 General Medical Services contract”

Meeting date: 18 June 2025

Richard Leonard

Did we get timescales yesterday?

Public Audit Committee

“General practice: Progress since the 2018 General Medical Services contract”

Meeting date: 18 June 2025

Richard Leonard

Okay. Everything within a year?

Public Audit Committee

“General practice: Progress since the 2018 General Medical Services contract”

Meeting date: 18 June 2025

Richard Leonard

The next plan about the plan will be published within a year?

Public Audit Committee

“General practice: Progress since the 2018 General Medical Services contract”

Meeting date: 18 June 2025

Richard Leonard

You just described the process as creating a bigger organisation. Presumably, part of the thinking behind merging two organisations is to rationalise and look at whether there is duplication, and whether a synergy might lead to fewer people being employed in the organisation or to the services being delivered in a different way. Is that part of your thinking?