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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 3 July 2025
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Displaying 2855 contributions

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COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

That is helpful. I will press you a little more on the specifics of Covid and being prepared for another pandemic. You suggest that, overall, countries are being sensible and are thinking through what cuts they would make. Are most countries protecting practical things such as PPE supply, laboratory availability and that kind of thing?

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

To focus on social security—Mairi Spowage might want to come in on this—the Scottish Fiscal Commission has warned that if we are more generous on social security than the rest of the UK is, we will need to find that extra money from somewhere, and that looks like being quite a serious amount of money that would need to be trimmed off somewhere else. I will come to Mr Hardt in a minute on the issue of raising more money. Are you still comfortable that we should have that focus on social security?

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

Perhaps I could come to Mairi Spowage on that point. To some extent, we have been warned about the potential costs of social security in future. Should we be worried about those, or can we cope with them?

11:00  

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

That is helpful.

I will move to Dr Hardt now. I thought that your submission was good. I was interested that, earlier, you said that you were surprised that there was an acceptance of the fixed budget. I would like to explore that.

Your submission says that we should be doing both preventative spending and downstream spending. The big challenge is whether we can do both at one time. The Finance and Public Administration Committee has certainly spent a lot of time on that. You also refer to the Reform Scotland report entitled “Taxing Times. Why Scotland needs new, more and better taxes”, which I thought was excellent.

I know that the issue is not just about finances, but is your main argument that we should be raising more so that we could do both preventative and downstream spending?

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

Thanks. Mairi Spowage wants to come back in.

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

That is very helpful.

I move to the alliance. I picked up in your paper that you were very positive about the spending emphasis on health, social care, social security and that side of things. However, here and also the other day at the Finance and Public Administration Committee, we heard from COSLA and local government that a lot of what they do is more preventative, and that people would not need to have social security or to go to accident and emergency if local government was funded better and had prevented some of those things from happening. What is your response to that?

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

Thanks very much. I do not have a specific question for you, Ms Watters, but if you want to come in, feel free.

However, I have a final question for Mr Gowans. You have already mentioned human rights budgeting, which I noticed you also mentioned in your submission. Will you explain to us, in a few words, what that means?

COVID-19 Recovery Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 22 September 2022

John Mason

My question is more about how that is done rather than necessarily about where the money is spent, which Dr Hardt spoke about earlier. I would have thought that, for example, our spending on education and housing and our provision of clean water are all for human rights, so is that not already happening?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Finances 2023-24 (Impact of Cost of Living and Public Service Reform)

Meeting date: 20 September 2022

John Mason

I could pursue that, but I will maybe leave it where it is.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Finances 2023-24 (Impact of Cost of Living and Public Service Reform)

Meeting date: 20 September 2022

John Mason

At the fact that there is little evidence. We hear arguments from some quarters that cutting income tax is a good idea that will boost the economy, but you say that there is not much evidence for that.