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City of Edinburgh Council provides a flat rate across all the different age ranges, but I think that the demands from two-year-olds would be higher. Could I ask you to have a look at that and perhaps follow up with any correspondence that you receive on it?

Does anybody else have any ideas?

We are not really getting to the nub of this. In 2010, there were 1,500 nursery teachers and there are now only 700. Does that not give an indication that we have moved from education to just childcare? That question is for Matthew Sweeney.

As you probably saw, there was quite a bit of debate last week about whether the new arrangements will make the process easier or more difficult. I can understand the motivation for the change, but could it potentially encourage more cross-border placements?

The representatives from the children’s commissioner’s office made the point last week that there would be a disparity between the rights of children coming from England and the rights of those in Scotland. I can understand why you would potentially have to double up the process—that is probably not legal language, either—in order to overcome that, which might create some difficulties for those who come from England. Are you concerned about the difference between the rights of children who come here from England and the rights of those who are already here?

I will push back a wee bit on that. I am not a defender of the Government, but COSLA has accepted that the settlement for the early learning and childcare offer was going to meet the needs. I know that there has been a reduction in funding in the past year and that there has been some rejigging of funds. However, the policy has been funded, so I am puzzled about why there has been such a reduction in nursery teachers over that period when, apparently, there has been enough money.

You have set the cat among the pigeons, and I commend you for that, but this is not the end of the debate. We need to return to the matter.

I am staggered by the admission that, somehow, those who work in the PVI sector are worth less, even though they are supposedly doing exactly the same job. I have some examples of pay rates. In Falkirk, a local authority head of centre is paid 71 per cent more than their private nursery manager equivalent, despite working fewer hours. In Glasgow, a deputy head of nursery is paid 87 per cent more than a deputy nursery manager in the PVI sector. Are you surprised that there is an exodus of staff from the PVI sector?

Yes. I am sorry—you have got the tough job today in having to defend this.

I agree. The letter that you sent to the committee was really helpful in clarifying a lot of the issues.

I am interested in what is motivating the change. Are excessive pressures on the court the driving force?