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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 12 January 2026
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Displaying 6691 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

Welcome back. We will continue with our next panel of witnesses on the draft climate change plan. This panel will focus on those policies and proposals in the draft plan that deal with the waste sector.

I welcome Gary Walker, head of specialist regulations at the Scottish Environment Protection Agency; Duncan Simpson, a member of the management committee of the Resource Management Association Scotland; Kim Pratt, senior circular economy campaigner for Friends of the Earth Scotland; and Iain Gulland, who was, until very recently—I think that I have that right—the chief executive of Zero Waste Scotland. I do not know what happened after recently, but he can no doubt tell us afterwards. Dr Lucy Wishart, a lecturer in the circular economy and sustainable transformations at the University of Edinburgh, joins us online. Thank you all for attending today. As is normally the way, I get to ask the simple questions at the beginning to put you all at ease.

The figures show that emissions from the waste sector fell sharply until about 2013 but that that fall then effectively stalled. I cannot understand the barriers or the reasons why. Gary, can you explain the barriers that make further reductions impossible and can you tell me why those reductions stalled? Is that quite a hard question to answer?

11:15  

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

I am not sure whether Rachel Aldred is trying to come in, but you are being given the opportunity to contribute before Kevin Stewart comes in with the next question. Does anyone want to respond?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

Thanks, Michael. Monica, I think that you have some questions now. Sorry—I have so many papers to do with the plan in front of me that I am not quite sure which one I am looking at currently. However, Monica is definitely next.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

That is if you can access a modal shift to buses in your area. Adrian Davis suggested that that might not be the case in rural areas.

Mark Ruskell has a supplementary question.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

I must apologise to you, too, Douglas.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

I want to drill down a bit into the draft climate change plan. Annex 2 addresses sectoral changes. When it comes to transport, on page 51, it says:

“In order to achieve our Net Zero targets in relation to the transport sector, action will be required to be taken by all members of society, from the general public, businesses, public sector organisations as well as all levels of government”,

which seems to be a call to arms. Then, on page 28 of annex 3, the total gross cost for achieving net zero in the transport sector is shown as about £12.7 billion and the net cost as £6.9 billion.

Can someone help me understand who is paying the £12.7 billion? Where is it coming from and where is it going? On the basis that you have all read the paper, Adrian Davis, do you want to have a go at answering?

09:15  

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

I understand that you did not write the plan, but you come to this meeting with a huge amount of knowledge. We are expecting everyone to read, understand and sign up to the plan, and not understanding or identifying the costs makes it more difficult for people. Do you want to have a go at that question, Sara?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

Phasing out private cars appears to be the direction of the plan, but, for a lot of rural people, private cars form the basis of just getting to a hospital appointment.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

I will go on to my pet subject, which you will not be surprised to hear is figures. Page 45 in annex 3 gives the figures for the cost of the climate change plan. It appears that, in every year, the benefits outweigh the costs of doing things, which is interesting. In the first period, from 2026 to 2030, the net costs are £89.9 million, and that includes the costs of a deposit return scheme, although we know that those figures are perhaps not quite in line with what the industry thinks are the costs.

Are you happy that the net costs in the climate change plan for waste management are reasonable, or are they lower because there are hidden costs of the burning of waste?

Iain Gulland, I do not have any confidence in the figures, but you will have looked at them and will have huge confidence in them, surely. Do you want to start us off?

11:30  

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Draft Climate Change Plan

Meeting date: 6 January 2026

Edward Mountain

In the earlier session, we heard about changing attitudes and getting people to buy into the plan and understand the costs and the benefits. That is what I am trying to drill down into, because I am struggling to understand them.

Kim Pratt, you are probably happy that the costs in annex 3, on page 45, are exactly right. Are you happy?