Seòmar agus comataidhean

Good morning and welcome to the 22nd meeting in 2023 of the Constitution, Europe, External Affairs and Culture Committee.

We have received apologies from Maurice Golden. I would like to express my thanks to him, Ben Macpherson and Dr Alasdair Allan, who are all moving on to new parliamentary duties, for having served on the committee. We wish you all well for the future and thank you for your incredible contribution to the work of the committee.

Our first agenda item is to look at how devolution is changing post-European Union. Our inquiry has been on-going and our final evidence session is with the cabinet secretary.

I welcome to the committee Angus Robertson MSP, Cabinet Secretary for Constitution, External Affairs and Culture, and, from the Scottish Government, Gerald Byrne, head of constitutional policy, and Euan Page, head of United Kingdom frameworks.

I invite the cabinet secretary to make an opening statement on the inquiry.

Thank you for your opening statement and for your letter in response to the committee’s questions that arose from our inquiry on how devolution is changing now that we are outside the EU.

I have a topical question to ask. Yesterday, we heard news of the success of the Alcohol (Minimum Pricing) (Scotland) Act 2012, with a 13 per cent reduction in the number of alcohol deaths in Scotland. It has proved to be a policy that works in that area. There is a request that the minimum unit value be increased, which is one of the things that we have covered in the committee as being a potential grey area following the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020 and withdrawal from the EU due to Brexit. Is the Government considering that at the moment? Are you concerned about it?

Does anyone have more questions or comments for the cabinet secretary?

Members indicated disagreement.]

I absolutely agree, cabinet secretary.

Mr Macpherson has a supplementary question in this area as well.

We have run slightly over where I had hoped to be, cabinet secretary, but I think that we have exhausted questions on that area. Thank you. We will suspend briefly while officials change over.

The committee has visited many areas of Scotland in the process of our inquiry and we have found the community-based or place-based aspect of what is going on to be important. Key to the evidence that we have taken on all those visits has been the input of the Culture Collective and how successful and well received that has been. Therefore, I am interested in your thinking about the future of that model.

Elite artists and national performing companies are in a different bracket from what might be delivered on the ground in local communities. It has been suggested that the model for culture should be like the sportscotland one, with elite activities funded in one way and grass-roots activities funded at a different level, on a local basis. Have you given any thought to that dynamic? How well do you think that the model is working at the moment?

I want to ask a supplementary question about the issues that Mr Cameron has asked about.

A theme that has arisen is that a lot of organisations that work in the cultural sector felt that during Covid they all of a sudden became trusted organisations by Creative Scotland and other funders. They could no longer deliver projects that had been funded and planned, but they were given the freedom to do something appropriate for communities, and they felt really trusted. Organisations have felt that they are on a treadmill in respect of the overheads that are involved in applying for funding from Creative Scotland, local authorities and other funders, such as the Big Lottery Fund.

In Wester Hailes, we heard about doughnut funding and that the core costs for organisations are never funded. When something is project based, a project adviser might come on for a certain amount of time, and maybe organisations get members of staff. However, it is really hard to get funding for all the fundamental core costs of getting places cleaned and swept and the administration of bookings, for example. Is that something that you have been made aware of? Is the Scottish Government considering the matter?

We have exhausted our time with you this morning, cabinet secretary. I thank you very much again for your attendance.

I have a few closing remarks to make. I again thank the members for whom this is their last time at committee. I wish them all the best in their new roles. This is the final meeting before the summer recess, so I thank all members, the clerks, the officials and advisers to the committee for their hard work during what has been a very busy time, as is evidenced by the fact that two inquiries have been discussed this morning.

I hope that everyone manages to have a well-earned rest, and I look forward to seeing you all again in September.

Mr Bibby, do you have a supplementary question in that area?