Seòmar agus comataidhean

First, my proposed commissioner would implement the public duty in legislation and according to the definition that would be set out in the bill, which is about policy coherence. The first job of the new commissioner, in that case, would be to raise awareness—to make sure that the 131 public bodies and 32 local authorities were aware of their new public duties, that they were interpreting them according to the commissioner’s own understanding, and that they were providing clear guidance, advice and support. I am not going to split those duties up into percentages, but I will say that that would take up the new commissioner’s first year. The commissioner would thereafter start holding bodies to account. Their investigatory powers and capacity to address non-compliance would come further down the line, and they would make people aware of the powers at the very start.

There have been two such commissioners in Wales: they have been different people with different approaches, but under the same legislation. Interestingly, there has been a Senedd committee review of the impact of commissioners and what can be learned in that respect, as well as of their day-to-day work. Therefore, you could review the commissioner on an on-going basis. I suggest, though, that they be appointed for a period of years, with the maximum time being, say, eight years. You would have a discussion about priorities when they were appointed in order to ensure that they had a plan that they were clear about. It is all about holding the commissioner to account and their being up front about their priorities when implementing the legislative duties that they have been appointed to deliver.

The issue of non-compliance is raised as part of my proposed legislation, because it would put in place a legal requirement to implement the public duty. That sort of thing will come with time, I think. In the early years, the role would be much more to do with engagement and encouragement, but with clear advice and guidance. A lot of that would come in the policy memorandum, and the guidance that will come out alongside the proposed legislation, but it would be built in from day 1.

Yes, I picked that up with the Auditor General, because I could see that some of the work that the Auditor General does is in the same field, although it is not the same work. In Wales, there is a relationship between the roles and there is liaison and clarity. There could be a memorandum of understanding so that neither body overreaches. However, that work is not done by the Auditor General, and it is not in their remit.

It is not the case that you would not talk to other organisations; there is lots to be learned from the children’s commissioner’s work with young people. When I did the consultation, I got positive feedback about having a distinct role that is independent from Government. If you are giving advice to 131 public bodies, there is a point to be made about learning from best practice and experience.

The main discussion that I had was with the Auditor General. I did not talk to other commissioners per se, because they have different roles and I was looking more at the sustainable development principles, sustainable development goals and wellbeing. I see it more as a cross-Government issue of policy coherence and policy development.

They formed part of the consultation process, because we asked, “What is the purpose of a commissioner?” and “How would a commissioner work?”

One of the things that I was very conscious of was the issue of feedback after the establishment of a commissioner, and the need to find out whether the commissioner has made a difference.

The consultation process was good, and I am now at the point where my proposed bill is with the Presiding Officer. I have had to go through the financial memorandum, which includes various estimates based on our thinking about the experience of existing commissioners. We have thought about how we could reduce the costs while still having the benefit of that commissioner, because, however passionate I and others are about climate change, we are not going to make the difference on our own. We can ask questions, but there needs to be a focus to make it happen. Even if you get a minister who is passionate about the issues, they are not there forever, and neither are Governments. There is something important about the longevity of commissioners.

I am not here to say where you should draw the line—that is up to MSPs. However, having this debate will make people think more carefully about whether such a commissioner is the only way of proceeding. In my view, having looked at the Welsh example and at what is happening globally, I would say that it definitely works as a way to deliver climate ambitions.

The fact that we are here today is part of that process, is it not? You have the criteria that were established by the Finance Committee and which we all look at when drawing up this sort of legislation.

In the end, it is an issue for parliamentarians. If members do not support our bills, they will not go through, and if the Government is not supportive of our proposed legislation and we do not get a majority for it, it will not go through. There is learning to be had from the existing commissioners and from looking at the gaps.

That is very kind; I will take that.

I will follow up on the link between access to services and funding. The stats on supported bus services and the impact of bus service cuts show that the impact is falling disproportionately on people who are already in deprived groups, and how it affects rural and peripheral urban areas is clearly an issue because people have a bus pass, but they cannot necessarily use it. We had a cross-party group meeting on sustainable transport, and that is what the young people said. They said that they loved the concept of a bus pass, but that it is not much use if they do not have a bus to use it on. What is the joined-up approach to give people access to bus services?

From looking at it, it is about having a joined-up approach. If we are here next year having a similar discussion, is it your expectation that we will have the same number of bus services or fewer bus services, and what is the geographic impact of that likely to be?

Thank you. I can say that, as a bus user in an area where I get to use my bus pass, it is fantastic, because we have buses in my region. On the edge of the region, however, I can see the difference. Bus services have to be higher up the political agenda.

Would it be possible to get a briefing on that so that we can translate what you have said into what that change means for people? It sounds very nice, but I would like to know how people put in a complaint and ask for information. As I understand it, the system no longer involves speaking to someone—it is an automated system. Could you provide us with a briefing on what that means?

Does the redeployment of staff mean that nobody has lost their job? I was told that staff redundancies were coming.

It would be good to get a briefing on that.