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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 15 July 2025
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Displaying 451 contributions

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Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Welfare of Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 25 October 2023

Christine Grahame

Just to go back to compliance, this is, as we all know, very discretionary—it is not mandatory. For example, section 10(1) says:

“The Scottish Ministers may by regulations make provision for or in connection with securing compliance with regulations”.

Also, you are worried about people inadvertently ending up being caught up in some proceedings, given a fine or something, but section 10(2)(b) recommends that

“That provision may in particular include ... provision for the enforcement other than by way of proceedings for an offence of any provision of the regulations”.

Does the minister accept that, if all that was given was a warning to somebody that they should have had a puppy registered, it could leave things open for somebody masquerading as an innocent person who has been caught out who is actually either being used by criminal gangs or part of a criminal gang?

We must accept that there are options other than by way of proceedings. As I have said, the regulations are for the Government—they are just guidance for it.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Welfare of Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 25 October 2023

Christine Grahame

My final question is about section 11. You asked how we know that what we are proposing will work. Would you accept that section 11 will improve public awareness and understanding of the relevant regulatory regimes? Its purpose is to ensure that people understand that the supplying of a dog that is less than 12 months old requires

“registration under regulations made under section 8”.

Do you accept that, in the context of the entire bill, the purpose of section 11 is not about raising awareness before registration is required, but about ensuring that, if we were to proceed with registration, the public would be aware that there was a registration scheme and that it would, in a way, be for the public to police it? If someone was not registered, people could check that out.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Welfare of Dogs (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 25 October 2023

Christine Grahame

It would depend on what was on the database. I put it to you that, if there were no registration number, they would not proceed, because it would be a requirement in law that the puppy or dog be registered. They would say, “It’s not registered. What’s that all about?”

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

I give you notice, minister, that I will lodge an amendment if you do not.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

Well, you have got it.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

If it is sensitive, that is fine. Expanding that would be helpful rather than our just having a letter that makes a reference to “Information provided”. Obviously, you have that information but we do not.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

It just struck me that practically everything you can get, you want to prevent.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

I am looking at what the Scottish Animal Welfare Commission does. It said:

“We looked at snares generically, but we have also looked at humane or modified cable restraints. The basic operation of the snare is the same whether it is modified or not ... We looked at that and we could not see any fundamental difference between the manner of operating of the conventional type and that of the new type.”—[Official Report, Rural Affairs and Islands Committee, 14 June 2023; c 60.]

I have two questions. First, why do you not simply come out and say, “We will go with the Scottish Animal Welfare Commission”? That is why it was set up.

Secondly, let us say that you try to ban the sale of snares. Have you raised that issue in relation to the United Kingdom Internal Market Act 2020 or are you raising it in advance with your UK counterpart? It is a case of not just possession and use but sale. The same issue will arise.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

The sentence that follows the table of detailed stats that the Scottish Government provided in the letter to us simply stated:

“Information provided by the National Wildlife Crime Unit shows the land use category most associated with raptor persecution incidents is grouse moors.”

It would be helpful to the committee to expand—perhaps not now but in a further letter—on what that information is and to give us some detail. It would help our understanding of that assertion if that point were expanded on.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee

Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 June 2023

Christine Grahame

Was it? Sorry, I have missed it.