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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 22 December 2024
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Displaying 835 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

No, other than that I look forward to reading the committee’s stage 1 report and to the debate that will be held in due course. I have no doubt that the committee will provide further food for thought on how we might achieve the very best of legislation for victims, both here and now and in the future.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

I have worked hard to listen to a range of views on all aspects of the bill. I genuinely believe that what complainers, the accused and we all require is a debate of the highest standard. I have set out that we prefer to go to a two-thirds qualified majority, because we need to ensure that we have the right protections and balance in the system. Bearing corroboration in mind, our judgment is that unanimity or near unanimity would be more than is required.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

Just for clarity—I really hope that I have not misheard Mr Findlay—I stand to be corrected, but I do not think for a minute that the Lord Advocate in her evidence last week was in any shape or form arguing for unanimity or near unanimity.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

Yes, a qualified majority.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

The short answer to your question is yes. The Scottish Government firmly believes that our law and legal processes must meet the needs of modern 21st century Scotland. Clearer and more transparent decision making is an important part of that.

As the committee heard during its evidence sessions, many people do not trust a verdict that cannot be adequately explained. It causes trauma to victims and can leave the accused with lingering stigma. The proposed reform is a historic one, and it is based on significant and long-standing concerns. The fundamental point is that we should always strive to increase confidence that verdicts are returned on a sound and rational footing, while ensuring balance and fairness to all parties.

I believe that there is broad support for the measure. At the most recent Scottish general election, four political parties’ manifestos contained commitments to abolish the not proven verdict, and the idea attracted strong support in the Government’s consultation.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

Convener, are you asking me about jury size, jury majority or both?

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

In terms of—

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

It would always have to be based on a parliamentary decision, because, irrespective of its merits or otherwise, the right to a retrial would be a significant departure from what we have now. That is not to say that it should not be considered or scrutinised, but it would nonetheless be a significant change that I contend would need to be looked at properly and considered fully.

I am trying to assure the committee that we will consider the Lord Advocate’s evidence—we have started that process—but that, as with all legislation, we also need to look at the detail. Where there would be significant departures, we would have to think carefully about whether stage 2 or stage 3 amendments would be appropriate for such changes. The answer to that question might be yes or no. I am trying to convey to the committee that we all need to be collectively invested in the understanding and debate around these very complex and difficult decisions.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

Some people have argued for the retention of the not proven verdict on the basis of its uniqueness.

Criminal Justice Committee

Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 February 2024

Angela Constance

I am deeply surprised by that. Just a few moments ago, you heard me speak at length to the convener. I outlined, admittedly in broad terms, what the evaluation would look at. It would look at outcomes and at whether there is a conviction or an acquittal, because those are outcomes, but there is so much more to the pilot.

I will be absolutely up front with you, Mr Findlay: I am not opposed to or anti juries. There is a real value to juries.