Seòmar agus comataidhean

I suppose that the biggest wins for Scotland are in the health space. Obviously, that has the biggest portion of our budget, and it is where savings could be made. I have sympathy, as it would be easier if this happened at a time when there was an increasing spending envelope, rather than at a time when there is a decreasing spending envelope. However, that is the point of this work. We need to continue to talk about transparency. Perhaps the officials will reflect on how we might account for preventative spend differently.

I will move on to a different area. Last week, we had the minister responsible for the national care service in front of us. I asked about the amount of money to be allocated in the longer run to the national care service. On expenditure, Maree Todd said:

“I will be candid and say that the cabinet secretary has not set a ceiling.”—[Official Report, Finance and Public Administration Committee, 26 September 2023, c 16.]

Is that correct?

Thank you.

I bet the kids loved it, though.

I want to ask the witnesses whether they feel that there is a coherent plan for growth in Scotland. The language of growth seems to be a bit more fashionable now, driven by the budget gap that we talked about earlier. Sandy Begbie made some points about how to grow the base. A lot of what some of you have said today feels quite defensive of what support there is. Is there a plan for growth from the Government?

There are discussions, but I am not hearing much about actions or what the measures that will deliver growth actually look like.

What I am working towards here is that that is not very far away.

My last question relates to that specific issue. One of the issues with the inclusion of children’s services was the fact that most social work practitioners in Scotland had no idea that this was being proposed or that they might, as a result, be transferred from their current employers into some different form of employment that had yet to be decided. Has any proper engagement happened with the profession in that respect?

That is good to hear. Thank you.

Minister, you will be aware that the Government’s medium-term financial strategy projects a shortfall of £1 billion in 2024-25 and £1.9 billion in 2027-28. What has the Cabinet Secretary for Finance told you that the country can afford to spend on the national care service?

So, she has not given any indication of the spending envelope that might be available.

When the medium-term financial strategy was published, the Scottish Parliament information centre, the Fraser of Allander Institute and the Institute for Fiscal Studies all commented that figures for the policy were missing from those projections, so whatever you are being given to spend to make the policy happen is not included in them.

It comes down to the question of what comes first. You are saying a lot about co-design and putting the right system in place, but I am not getting a sense of real confidence that we are working in a financially prudent way to think about the financial limitations. How far are such limitations informing the co-design process?