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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 11 February 2026
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Displaying 985 contributions

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Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Minister, it is good to hear that you accept the judgment and that you want to follow the law. However, it has recently emerged that SNP ministers have issued a declaration of incompatibility with regard to the Supreme Court’s judgment for the For Women Scotland case. Why is the Scottish Government seeking to undermine the law by putting the rights of dangerous criminals, who claim to be women, above the rights of some of the most vulnerable women?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

It is quite detailed, but it is important to understand if the Scottish Government is breaking the law.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Thank you, convener. I have one question and then a supplementary. John, you said in response to my colleague Tess White that the EHRC sent an updated code of practice for services, public functions and associations to the UK Government following the Supreme Court judgment in the For Women Scotland case. Has there been any further update from the UK Government and has there been any engagement with the Scottish Government?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Yes, I am asking whether the commission has changed its position.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Do you have a timetable for that?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Do you also understand that you cannot compare apples and pears and that there are some things that you cannot provide services for if you do not have the correct data? Basically, self-ID will screw up the data, especially when it comes to ethnic minorities—people like me. How will you know if females from an ethnic minority are being discriminated against in any way if data on biological sex is not captured? If you use self-ID, people will not have the exact data and would not know what is happening. You talked about the pay gap and other things. Do you not agree that self-ID would muddy the waters?

11:00

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

I have one last question. I asked the earlier panel a question about data. It was emphasised that there is a big gap in the data and a lot of work needs to be done around it. The need to collect the right data was also emphasised. Do you agree that it is important to be collecting data on biological sex for equality monitoring? Will you be withdrawing the 2021 guidance, which still encourages data collection based on self-ID?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Yes, thank you.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Public Sector Equality Duty

Meeting date: 13 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

It was to do with engagement with the Scottish Government.

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prevention of Domestic Abuse (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 January 2026

Dr Pam Gosal MBE

Absolutely. On those, when I began working on the bill, some of the organisations that also came here to give evidence asked me what I would do in the cases of women who retaliate and what sort of offences the bill would cover. They asked me what would happen if there were blanket offences that covered everybody. That was one area where I really listened to stakeholders and victims to ensure that my bill would make a difference.

Honestly, Ms Mackay, I am open to any amendments and to looking at the thresholds. I know that the committee has discussed whether we should cover only offenders on indictment, only repeat offenders or a lot more people. I am quite open to using the stage 2 and 3 mechanisms.