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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 22 April 2025
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Displaying 1135 contributions

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Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

So, should we expect to see a reversal of the proposals in Glasgow and Edinburgh?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

I am sorry; I did not catch that.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

I declare my interest as a national health service general practitioner.

Minister, you spoke about underage drinkers. Can you point me to the evidence that shows that MUP has reduced underage drinking?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Are you specifically saying that MUP has led to a decrease in underage drinking? That was my question.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

I am sure that that is the case, but the quote that you used was about underage drinking and Public Health Scotland said that it has found no evidence that MUP has reduced underage drinking. Is that correct?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Minister, you said that dependent drinkers were never the focus of the policy. Is that your position?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

You referred to problematic drinkers. We could certainly have a discussion about what that means. However, “really problematic drinking”—which is the term that was used in the court’s findings—goes further than that, does it not?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Yes.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

In Public Health Scotland’s report, civil servants decided to intervene and change the wording. For example, the wording was supposed to be “consistent”, but civil servants decided to write “strong and consistent”, which is the wording that appeared, not in the draft, but in Public Health Scotland’s final report.

We can see, as Tess White said earlier, that a 40 per cent reduction in alcohol treatment has occurred. Although the minister has said many times that that is not the silver bullet, that the issue is nuanced, and that lots of other things need to be done, the fact is that nothing else is being done. This is the Government’s silver bullet; this is the only thing that it seems to be doing when it comes to alcohol. We simply need to see more treatment happening, because that has been proved to reduce people’s dependence on alcohol, to reduce deaths, and to improve and save lives.

We also need to look at the fact that a policy that increases the price of alcohol will affect dependent drinkers disproportionately. The whole point about being a dependent drinker is that you drink to the exclusion of other things—it is your primary focus and you are dependent on that substance. It is absolutely awful that the MUP policy has increased the price of alcohol, which the Government must have known would affect dependent drinkers, and that, over time, nothing has been done to help those dependent drinkers to ensure that they did not spend more money on alcohol and that they actually came away from it. We should have known—the Government and the 25 civil servants who worked on the policy should have known—that that would happen.

I want to speak about the outrageous profits that are being made by retailers because of MUP. It is simply unacceptable that a policy that is designed to help people is creating huge amounts of money, but that money is not being reinvested in alcohol programmes or in helping the people whom the policy was designed to help.

10:45  

It was made clear in court that the policy is not supposed to be a population-level approach. That is not what the Government said in court. The minister told me, however, that that was the point. That does not make sense to me.

Turning to other evidence, a Taiwanese group wrote in The Lancet that the modelling that was done was simply not accurate, and that the policy is not doing what we think it is doing.

The fact is that the number of people who have died because of alcohol has increased by 25 per cent. That is the figure. Saying that we have saved 156 lives in modelling suggests that, had we not had MUP, we would have had the highest number of deaths ever.

We have heard from the minister that there are confounders, and that the biggest confounder is simply the cost of living. There has also been Covid. We must see, with a full evaluation, what happens in five years’ time, when, I hope, we will not have those confounders. That could give us a really good indication of what is going on.

The minister has said that we are looking to increase the amount that is spent on treatment of drug and alcohol problems. I welcome that, and I ask the minister to back the Conservatives’ proposed right to addiction recovery (Scotland) bill, which would give people the right to treatment, which would force our health and social care partnerships to invest at that level.

In summary, I say that the evaluation has not proved that MUP has done what we set out that it would do, which was that it would help the heaviest drinkers in our society. We need to ensure that, if MUP continues, we use the money that is generated to help those people. Otherwise, it is an absolute travesty.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Abortion Services (Safe Access Zones) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Imagine that I am going to work in haematology and I find myself upset by an abortion protest outside the hospital. Would the bill cover my being upset by that, even if I was not influenced by it?