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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 4 July 2025
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Displaying 1225 contributions

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Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

We are hearing that the cost of setting up the NCS could be up to £1.5 billion. Do you think that such an expensive restructuring is the best way to improve social care delivery? I will start with Tracy Dalling.

11:45  

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

I will stay with you, Tracey, because I want you to be clear. I do not want to put words in your mouth, but given what I am hearing, this is my question. Do you trust that all the things in the bill will be delivered at that cost, and do you believe that staff will be looked after?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Could you explain why?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

We are used to seeing details in bills, because it is on issues of detail and delivery that a bill can fail. I do not get into my car and drive without knowing my destination.

What exactly is the panel’s understanding of what co-design is? Colin Poolman alluded to that. What about the people who are missing, such as people who have palliative care needs? Who feeds into the process, and at what level? How does the Scottish Government reach out? Who makes the decisions? How transparent is the final design? Will there be a board that makes the final decisions? Do all voices—for example, that of the Royal College of Nursing versus that of one person—hold equal sway?

I have asked a lot of questions, but my question is basically about what the witnesses understand by the co-design process and whether that is clear.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

I would like to start with Kay McVeigh. Does the bill as it is laid out guarantee robust training for all staff that are being transferred?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 15 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

With regard to recruitment and retention, I have heard Alison Bavidge say that the average social worker is in post for six years—

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Rural and island communities face significantly different challenges to the rest of the country. What impact do you anticipate that a one-size-fits-all approach to a national care service would have on those communities?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Dr Williams, if we are looking at a fully integrated service, GP care and primary care in general need to be part of that. However, given the change that is happening to the IJBs and, in particular, the lack of GPs and primary care practitioners in the Highlands and rural areas, does the national care service not pose a risk?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

Good afternoon. One of the interesting things that you said was about the setting up of an arm’s-length body. Having spoken to the unit that is working on the bill, it is clear to me that that is not going to happen. Audit Scotland suggests that setting up a national care service could cost more than £1.3 billion. Given that that money would be taken away from health boards and local government, do you feel that it is worth it? It could, for instance, remove the potential for local government to do certain things. We were told that one council might lose its lawyer unit because work would be taken away from it.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 November 2022

Dr Sandesh Gulhane

The Scottish Association of Social Workers raised concerns that these national care service proposals could exacerbate recruitment issues, as Dr Williams mentioned in his earlier answer to me about a system that we cannot staff. Alison White, do you agree with that assessment? If so, how would the proposals exacerbate those issues?