Seòmar agus comataidhean

Thank you. In evidence to the committee and through engagement as part of my fact-finding work on the bill, I have heard that there is an obvious difference between capturing population-level data and capturing individual-level data. We have touched on population-level data.

When it comes to individual-level data, there are concerns about people falling off the radar for particular health services. I appreciate that this is not directly related to the bill, but I think that it is important that we consider the issue. I make it clear that I think that trans people absolutely understand their bodies—they are probably more mindful of their physical bodies than other people are, for various reasons. However, what more can the Government do to ensure that trans women and trans men are called for the health service to which they will need to be called, on the basis of biological characteristics that they might retain after getting a gender recognition certificate?

The Scottish Trans Alliance has a mechanism in place to do with community health index—CHI—number changes, which has worked in different areas. How could we support such an approach to data gathering?

I have a few questions on a number of topics, convener, but I will be as quick and succinct as I can. Thank you for your patience.

The British Psychological Society has said that medical pathways are not contingent on the GRA, but we have heard concerns about health services for trans people in general and in relation to their transition specifically. For example, there are waiting times of four years in some areas of Scotland; general practitioners could charge fees; and, of course, trans people can have really poor health and mental health outcomes. Cabinet secretary, are you in a position to commit to reviewing health services for trans people? What can you do to ensure that, should they wish to do so, trans people can get timely access to gender identity and support services?

I appreciate that answer, cabinet secretary, and I understand what implications the bill might or might not have for health services. However, we have heard in a number of evidence sessions about the experience of trans people in the round, and I thought that it would be helpful if we put that question to you today. Indeed, it would be remiss of us if we did not do so.

The bill contains a number of reporting mechanisms, and I note that those outlined for the registrar general for Scotland are considerably more restricted than they are for bodies elsewhere in the UK. I am thinking, for example, of the Ministry of Justice. Are you open to looking at further reporting mechanisms and collection of data on people’s date of birth, birth status and so on to get a clearer picture of people across Scotland, including on the number of trans people?

Yes, that would be helpful. Thank you.

The children’s commissioner spoke about the presumption in the children’s bill that children and young people have capacity to share their views with the court. Would something similar be helpful in this bill?

Thank you.

We heard from people who transitioned and then transitioned again—which is sometimes called detransitioning—that there is a lack of clarity in the bill about the process for that. Will you say what you understand the process to be for someone who transitions and then decides to transition again? How would you protect those people from a criminal process? That is, how can you tell the difference between someone making a false declaration and someone seeking to transition again?

Thank you—that was really helpful.

The other area that I am interested in—

Convener, I have some questions in other areas.

My further question around the registrar general touches on the issue of age. The registrar general and the Children and Young People’s Commissioner Scotland both spoke of the need for support. The registrar general, I think, said that there had been conversations with the cabinet secretary on the sort of support and on the organisations that would provide it to people, so that they could understand the effect of the gender recognition certificate. Cabinet secretary, can you say what those conversations have been and who you think those organisations might be? You mentioned that it could cost approximately £350,000 to set up the system, with on-going costs of £150,000. For some support, that could be considered quite a small amount. Will you set out the detail on that and on the role that young people will have in developing support and guidance?

In the bill, it is set out that there will be regulations on the form and on the information that the registrar general will be able to collect. You have already touched on that—and I will come back to the issue of young people in a moment, if the convener allows it—but would you be prepared to publish the regulations for the registrar general ahead of the bill being finished at stage 2?

Thank you. My final question on this topic is about the prison service. We have briefly spoken about that and, notwithstanding the comments on the numbers involved, which are small, is it your view that, following the review of Scottish Prison Service guidance, a gender recognition certificate would not be considered as a kind of passport as it has been in other areas of the UK, and that the approach would remain risk based, both to the trans person and to the other people who are living in prison at the time? Would a risk-based approach still take precedence over the relevance of a GRC?