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Councillor Heddle, do you want to come in on that?

You have set me up very well for my next question. I think that I am starting to understand community wealth building. The committee will consider that bill at some point. As my understanding of the subject has deepened, I have started to see that a good part of community wealth building could be delivered through community planning partnerships. Therefore, I am interested in what you think the role of CCPs will be in community wealth building, as well as in relation to Covid recovery, which has been talked about in our evidence sessions, and the new deal for local government.

Given that you mentioned the words “community wealth building”, I will start with you, Councillor Heddle.

I will open with a number of questions about culture change before we move to the other themes that have been explored in our evidence session so far.

Back in 2015, community planning was seen as being central to public service reform in tackling inequalities and aiding prevention, as you have both articulated. The committee has heard that the picture on the ground is very variable, as you have both said. I am interested in your sense of the impact that community planning has had. Perhaps the minister could answer first.

Thank you. Your point about a streamlining approach is true; the issue is where the intervention point is that will give us the most impact for the activities that we carry out.

That leads nicely on to questions from Willie Coffey, who will lead on the theme of leadership, accountability and audit.

I do not know whether this is the right place to ask this question, but I will do so. We have NPF4, local development plans and, my favourite topic, local place plans—I see Andy Kinnaird smiling, because he knows that I often bring them up. One of my concerns is about local development plans, which you have said might take five years to create—that is an interesting and useful bit of information. A community might not have wanted to create a local place plan or get on board with its local development plan. If people just put in place a done-and-dusted local development plan and say, “Here it is,” how could that be opened up at a later stage, to give space for community expression to be honoured and respected through a local place plan?

Yes. My question comes back to questions around ecosystems and food security in Scotland. I will direct it to Morgan Vaughan and Ian Boyd-Livingston. In the papers that we received for today’s meeting, there is the statement that

“agroecological approaches can provide sufficient nutrients for healthy diets without impinging on natural habitats”.

However, we are told that

“these assumptions imply systemic change which, while possible, would require significant political and social shifts, and shifts in production systems to support e.g. more fruit and vegetable production.”

What do we need to see in the bill or in the criteria for support payments to incentivise the required political and social shifts and a shift towards more fruit and vegetable production?

Thank you very much for that. It is important for us to be aware of all those issues.

My next question comes under the area of ecosystem pressure points—we have started to touch on that matter already—but it is also related to the agriculture bill. I hear the points that have been made about the need to point towards actions rather than be focused on outcomes. The bill will be a framework bill, which will be challenging in some ways.

I will address my question to Pete Smith and then Tim Benton. I am interested in hearing really clearly what should be specified in the agriculture bill to ensure that policies and financial support are put in place to enable the sector to adapt to climate and environmental change in the most ecological and sustainable way. We have talked about agro-ecology and regenerative practice, but what do we need in the bill to ensure that any future subordinate legislation, any powers that are given, or the tier 1, 2 and 3 payments move our farming production in the right direction so that it addresses the weak link on food security that Tim Benton mentioned, which is concerning?

That is perhaps a big question. I will start with Pete Smith and then go to Tim Benton.

It kind of does, yes.

That is probably something that we should take away. We should reflect seriously on the idea of food being part of our national security, given how events have brought that idea to the fore.

Is anyone else able to take that question? Maybe no one else was paying attention because I said that it was for David. Will livestock production be more at risk from climate change than other farming sectors, because of heat stress in animals and a shortage of forage? If that is the case, how can the sector adapt to climate impacts while minimising its contribution to climate change?

It seems that those questions were too geeky for people. Brilliant—we have some takers. We will hear from Morgan Vaughan, then Tim Benton.