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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 17 September 2025
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Displaying 899 contributions

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Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

That is great—thank you.

I take it that Fulton MacGregor has no further supplementary questions, so I will bring in Maggie Chapman.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Thank you. Karen, did you want to ask anything further on that?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

If no one else wants to come in, I just want to say on behalf of the committee that we have found this to be a very useful session. I think that we have managed to get under the skin of some of the areas of contention to ensure that we move on at pace while also providing a very thorough scrutiny process.

We all appreciated the way in which Juliet Harris brought alive the children’s voices in such a practical way through the image of the spider’s web. From our point of view, we want to ensure that that web is robust so that in the future, when we add on all the bits that will strengthen children’s rights, we have a framework—a web—that is robust enough to carry them.

I agree that children are well able to understand complicated concepts regarding their own needs, wants and rights. When I was a teacher prior to being elected and we were doing rights-respecting schools, the articles in the UNCRC and so on, I could see that children were well able to express—not only orally but through pictures and multisensory play—their knowledge of all the different articles. In one sense, it appears that they were well ahead of us adults and that the legislative process is just catching up with them.

In that spirit, then, I thank you very much for your contributions this morning. Your evidence will certainly add to our scrutiny.

I suspend the meeting very briefly to allow for a change of panels.

10:55 Meeting suspended.  

11:00 On resuming—  

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I bring in Fulton MacGregor, who is online.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Thank you for that. I will bring in my colleague Paul O’Kane.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I want to move on, because time is precious. I know that members are going to be covering some of the points that will come up, so everyone will get an opportunity to comment.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Good morning, and welcome to the 21st meeting in 2023 of the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee in session 6. We have received no apologies.

Our first agenda item is to decide whether to take in private agenda item 3, which is consideration of today’s evidence. Do members agree to do so?

Members indicated agreement.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I thank all of you for those opening comments.

To get us started, would any of you like to share your view of the Scottish Government’s approach in responding to the Supreme Court’s judgment and of its proposed amendments to the bill?

Jan Savage, I noticed that you said in your opening statement that you felt that that was the only way to proceed and that there were no alternatives. Could you offer a bit of insight into why you believe that so firmly and whether any alternatives were considered? We will hear from Jan first, but other members of the panel can indicate if they would like to come in.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I invite Dr Andrew Tickell to speak.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill: Reconsideration Stage

Meeting date: 31 October 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I will just jump back in for a moment. The bill’s provisions will commence six months after the bill receives royal assent. Is that sufficient time for duty bearers and rights holders to prepare for the amended approach before the legislation comes into force? I will ask Councillor Buchanan and then Derek Frew to respond to that.