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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 23 December 2025
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Displaying 2665 contributions

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Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

I was actually sitting in a lay-by at the time of the conversation.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

I make this point purely on the basis that I absolutely agree that some of the responses that came back to members of the public and to people who were applying for licences were absolutely ludicrous—there is no dispute about that. However, that comment applied to one or two of the responses to the hundreds of licence applications that were made. I dispute Mr Ross’s characterisation of the organisation as incompetent. It is far from being incompetent, and it must take account of all the issues, not just an individual’s experience at one time.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

It has not acted illegally. It has clarified that nuisance is not the same as health and safety.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

Under the current legislation, it cannot do that. I cannot remember the exact wording, so this is perhaps not as it is set out in the act, but we cannot revert to what was done previously, because the act, or the protection, does not allow it. That is why NatureScot had to change its approach.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

Given that it is mid-December, I suggest that there is time before the next breeding season, because NatureScot will be working at pace with local authorities to work out what it will do for next season. As I said, we can give a ministerial instruction to require NatureScot to do something, and that work is on-going. The fact that we are not in the breeding season right now indicates to me that there is still time for NatureScot to deliver those plans.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

The plan not being—

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

No. Previously, licences had to be issued on the basis of health and safety rather than nuisance. What was happening previously was that health and safety and nuisance were being conflated.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

The conditions are not legally binding; they are certainly not as legally strong as the bill that is in front of the committee. I return to point that I have made right from day 1 of trying to get through, first, the Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Act 2024 and then part 4 of the bill: it is about changing the narrative in Scotland. If there is absolute trust that everything that is going on in estates is good quality, well managed and all the rest of it, that changes the narrative. It changes the ridiculous position that we are in just now whereby people feel demonised for doing a particular job. I would like to change that.

Amendment 35 helps us to do that, because the people of Scotland will look at grouse moor management and say, “You know what? This is robustly regulated, they’re doing a very good job, they’re bringing money into our rural communities and they’re doing the things that help us to be Scotland plc.” However, without the trust, we will still be in a position in which people do not trust what is happening on estates. This is not about us trying to demonise or not trusting landowners; it is about ensuring that there is absolute certainty in everybody’s mind that what is happening in those places is good for Scotland.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

Let me rephrase that: the conditions are not as legally strong. They do not have the same legal strength as the legislation that we are in the process of bringing in. The other part of it is that, if NatureScot is working with estates in drawing up boundaries, they have a discussion and negotiation—they come to an agreement. It is not done by one side or the other; it is done in agreement. The position that we are in will help to strengthen the robustness of the legislation, but it will also give security to landholders that they are portraying the image of a properly regulated, well-run business that is good for Scotland. That will help us to change the narrative, which, at the moment, is not as good as it could be.

Rural Affairs and Islands Committee [Draft]

Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Jim Fairlie

Although amendment 253 is well intentioned, it contains a fundamental flaw. The provisions in the bill will not be commenced in unison—a staggered approach will be taken—so it is unclear when the proposed five-year review period would start.

In addition, as I have set out in amendment 74, the review that I propose will look at more than just sections 13 to 16 of the bill. It will look at all the modifications that have been made to the 1996 act.

I would be happy to work with Mr Eagle on my proposed mechanism for reviewing the operation and effectiveness of the modifications made to the 1996 act by part 4 of the bill. However, based on what I have said, I ask Mr Eagle not to move amendment 253. If he moves it, I ask members to oppose it.

Amendment 74 agreed to.

Amendment 253 not moved.