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Yes. I heard that evidence. I can reflect on the situation in my constituency; I know that the local support cafe is looking to work much more closely with the justice system so that there is a supportive element through somebody’s release from custody and they go into a supportive environment that means that they are supported in the community in a much better way. I know that that is being considered more widely. I heard that from the panel this morning, and we are absolutely looking to do better on it.

First of all, services absolutely should be doing that. Mr Doris raises a very challenging case in his constituency, and I pay tribute to him for trying to ensure that co-ordination is provided. He suggests that it has not been and that, as we have discussed in response to previous questions about referrals between statutory bodies and community and voluntary organisations, there should be better co-ordination.

As he was speaking, I was thinking about what the Thistle is seeking to provide. It is a safe space for drug consumption, but it is also part of a pathway for people to be able to get access to services—that was a critical part of the Lord Advocate being willing to provide her letter of comfort—because there are statutory services within it, including housing, social work and various other services.

The evidence that is coming through from the Thistle’s early work is that people are able to engage with those statutory services in a way that has not been seen before. The Thistle is speaking to people who services have not spoken to before. The early evidence suggests that the intention in relation to that pathway, which was critical to the Lord Advocate’s willingness to provide her letter of comfort, is working. However, we have more work to do—I have already acknowledged that—to make sure that there is more joined-up communication between services and that referral pathways are being put in place.

The specific example that Mr Doris gave relates to the need to make sure that there is co-ordination and that every organisation seeks to provide a supportive environment to resolve issues. That should be what we all expect to take place.

Absolutely. I would welcome that.

First, I point to an example of where what we are doing in that area is starting to work better. I gave Ms Mackay this example in the chamber in answer to a question that she asked following my statement on the MAT standards. I am referring to the employment of staff in the Thistle centre and the fact that the design of that service has been carried out with people with lived and living experience. They have been not just a part of it, but central to it—indeed, people with lived and living experience were on the staff interview panel. That tells me that we are starting to get to a better place from the point of view of our work to destigmatise and to value those experiences more highly.

We have more work to do on how we employ those people. However, funding is available for organisations—Maggie Page or Laura Zeballos will remind me of the details—to ensure that people can be supported into the workplace and that there is a route for them to value themselves more highly as they progress. The point about feeling value in themselves was made very strongly when the First Minister and I visited the Thistle and spoke to those with lived and living experience who had helped to shape the service by being involved in the interview process and were participating in its establishment. The feeling of value and worth was incredibly powerful during that visit.

Laura Zeballos might be able to point to the funding that is available for organisations that provide support.

Paul Sweeney will understand that I cannot give him all of what will be contained in the framework until it is published. He and I share the view—as do colleagues around this table—that it is central for us to tackle the pervasive impact that poverty has on so many aspects of an individual’s life and experience. We have a clear indication of the correlation that exists between poverty and deprivation and the likelihood of people having a substance dependency, which was mentioned by a colleague on the previous panel. We also know from the drug death statistics that there is a clear correlation between poverty and deprivation and someone losing their life to a substance dependency. That is why the Government’s central focus and number 1 priority is addressing child poverty and doing what we can to eradicate it. The same panel member reflected on the fact that we do not have all the tools in the box to do that—decisions that are taken elsewhere also have an impact.

Addressing poverty has an impact on education, on justice and on health. The drivers of ill health are absolutely clear, and the health professional who was on the previous panel will be very familiar with them. Health inequalities and health conditions are driven by poverty. If we could tackle poverty, we would hugely reduce the demand on health and social care services, and we would dramatically reduce the number of drug and alcohol-related deaths. That is why it is right for us to have a cross-Government focus on addressing child poverty.

Through the population health framework, there is a clear focus on doing what we can to resolve poverty, but the health service in and of itself cannot do that. The environmental and social factors that drive people into poverty are outside the control of the health service. We pick up the impact of poverty, and that is why having a co-ordinated approach across Government to address poverty is so important for us. Indeed, that should be an overriding priority of all Governments.

I have been able to see the impact of that funding via the Corra Foundation in many of the community organisations that I have visited. As Ms Nicoll said, the fact that it has been possible to provide the funding on a multiyear basis is helpful.

In response to a question about the MAT standards statement, I set out that we are considering what comes next and what we can do to build on the national mission that is due to end next year, and that funding option will be part of that consideration. We will look at how we can learn from the organisations in which we have been investing and consider the impact that they have had and what we need to do next. That will ensure that there is clarity for organisations and individuals. In that way, we are seeking to build on the national drugs mission rather than feeling that, when 2026 comes, our work is done, as it is clearly not.

The charter’s publication was a critical moment, not only in Scotland but internationally, in understanding and embedding the rights of people who seek to access services. I found it an incredible day to be part of, as I heard from international experts and academics who talked so positively about the progress that was being made in Scotland and held up Scotland as an example for others to follow in relation to embedding the rights of people to access the services that they need. That was a positive development. The First Minister was present for the charter’s unveiling in December, and we are committed to it.

We want to ensure that we get the human rights bill right, that the drafting of it works and that there is support in the Parliament for it so that it can progress. We are taking the time to ensure that that is the case, which is why we partially support that recommendation from the people’s panel. We need to take the time to ensure that we get the bill right and deliver for people, because we understand its importance. We will continue to work on that matter in order to make progress.

I will need to come back to Mr Doris on that particular point, unless my colleagues can provide any further detail on it. We are certainly keen to ensure that any perceived barriers to organisations sharing data and referrals are removed, and that there is much smoother communication not only between different parts of the health service but between the health service and social care and, in this case, ADPs and those in the community and voluntary sector who are delivering services for those who need, and are seeking, treatment. We are working and engaging on that, but I will come back to Bob Doris on the exact detail that he asked for.

Good morning, colleagues. I am grateful for the opportunity to appear before the joint committee to reflect on the people’s panel’s report and to update you on the vital work that is under way to address the harms and deaths that, sadly, are caused by drugs and alcohol.

The last time I appeared before the committee was shortly after the publication of the 2023 drug deaths statistics. Those numbers told a story that, sadly, we have become all too familiar with, which is that, in 2023, 1,172 drug-related deaths were registered in Scotland, which was an increase of 12 per cent on the figure for 2022.

We must use every tool available to address the crisis. In that spirit, I welcome the work of the people’s panel. I thank the panel members and presenters, and the joint committee for instigating that important and valuable process. We should be heartened by the successes that are highlighted in the panel’s report, particularly our widely recognised naloxone programmes and the implementation of the Thistle facility in Glasgow. Those achievements were hard won, and I extend my gratitude to the people—especially the individuals with lived experience—who helped to make them a reality.

The panel calls for further and faster action, including on culture change, stigma and prevention. I assure you, convener and colleagues, that we remain committed to those principles across all our activity and focused on what works, and that we are using the evidence that we are aware of here and internationally to ensure that we target intervention and action where it is most needed. The Scottish Government has carefully considered the report’s conclusions and recommendations. As outlined in my written response to the committee, we are supportive of all the recommendations that have been made.

Since my previous appearance at the joint committee, our progress has continued at pace. The charter of rights, which was published in December, will support people who are affected by substance use to know and understand their rights in accessing support services. The value of lived experience and peer support in drug services has long been recognised, and we will publish new guiding principles on that this spring. Those principles, which are for all employers, regardless of sector, will set out how they can best support employees with lived and living experience to flourish in the workplace.

Whole-system and preventative change remains our utmost priority. In December, we published the mental health and substance use protocol, and we intend to publish the population health framework this spring. I am pleased to say that transition planning for after the mission ends in 2026 is also under way. In the statement to Parliament that I made earlier this month, I noted that we want to build on and learn from the foundation of the national mission to ensure that there is an on-going co-ordinated response to the harms that are caused by drugs and alcohol.

Scotland’s drug and alcohol deaths remain unacceptably high. Each death is a tragedy—a life lost too soon. However, we remain committed to change, driven by the belief that progress is both necessary and possible. In that vein, I welcome your questions and look forward to discussing the findings further.

First, what the panel’s report and statement demonstrate to me, not least in light of the fact that we have been able to support all the recommendations, is that, from a policy perspective, we are focusing on the right areas. From the panel’s perspective, we are focusing on the right areas. I am clear that we need to improve the pace, scale, co-ordination and consistency of the application.

As we build from the national mission, the services are being established, in some cases for the first time, and their co-ordination between different agencies needs to be supported. I heard that from the panel members who gave evidence earlier this morning, for which I am grateful. I accept that more needs to be done on that, and that there needs to be greater consistency. I am originally from Orkney, as Mr Balfour knows, and I know that ensuring that we get the provision right for people who live in rural and island communities, as well as those who live in urban conurbations, is critically important, as is ensuring that there is greater awareness—among not only those who have a drug dependency, but their families—of the services that are available.

In that respect, the situation is improving. The anecdotal evidence that I have obtained from speaking to family members, in particular, shows that action has been taken to reduce stigma and to provide clearer pathways for people to access services. Sadly, those pathways were not there for those whose lives have been lost. I have heard that directly from family members who have lost loved ones. However, they say that if their loved ones had experienced then what they would experience now, they would be in a different place. That tells us that we are making progress.