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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 26 April 2025
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Displaying 1499 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Effective Scottish Government Decision Making

Meeting date: 2 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

My last wee question is for Lucy Hughes. Your submission is excellent. I have asked about this a lot. I will quote you:

“The collection and analysis of intersectional gender-sensitive sex-disaggregated data on women’s experiences is central”

and it carries on. I feel that, in the short time that I have been here, I keep asking the same questions about routinely disaggregating data by sex, but get no further forward. If we do not know what the position is, we cannot begin to move forward. It seems as though we are continually making decisions with one arm tied behind our back. We do not know what the actuality is, because we are not collecting the data that would tell us. Is that your sentiment? What do you say in your submission about the quality of decision making for 51 per cent of our population?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (Grangemouth Area)

Meeting date: 19 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

Good morning, and thank you for attending. Professor Skea and Lang Banks have both made comments about the local community. During the inquiry, we have had compelling evidence from the local community council in the Grangemouth area, which has indicated that it feels that there is a disconnect in engagement in the just transition process. Could both of you flesh out your thoughts about what a good co-design process would look like in the development of the just transition plan and, critically, what it would feel like for the local community? I can see Lang Banks on the screen, so I will go to him first.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (Grangemouth Area)

Meeting date: 19 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

Before I bring in Lang Banks, I will add another dimension. I do not disagree with your approach of utilising what you already have, Professor Skea, but in addition—this is for Lang Banks—is there not a risk that by scraping the data that you already have, you will miss key insights, for example, by not having a gendered lens to see how the just transition is or is not impacting on women? It is not just about women; it relates to diversity in all its forms. Perhaps you could add your reflections on that in your answer, Lang.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (Grangemouth Area)

Meeting date: 19 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

They say that you get what you measure. Therefore, the measures and data collectors frame what the focus will be—in other words, what you are going to measure and the collection of the data—so that we can determine to what extent success has occurred. I would appreciate your thoughts on that. How advanced are we in having in place real data collectors on a standardised methodology basis? In other words, is that quite easy to do, or is it still developing? I put that question to Professor Skea.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (Grangemouth Area)

Meeting date: 19 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

You make an important point about the feedback loop. Thank you.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Effective Scottish Government Decision Making

Meeting date: 18 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

Good evening. Thank you for joining us at a time that must be very late in your day.

I am thinking about the similarities between Scotland and New Zealand. I often say that the best thing about Scotland is that everybody knows everybody, and the worst thing about it is that everybody knows everybody. We tend to find that we bring in similar representatives and panels, so we work very hard to try to get different people. Sometimes, that is hard because of the size of the pool. Is there a similar issue in New Zealand? If so, to what extent have you considered how that affects effective decision making and quality of delivery?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Effective Scottish Government Decision Making

Meeting date: 18 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

Following on from that, I note that you have a policy methods toolbox that describes how to use behavioural insights. Will you tell us a bit more about that? What training do people go through? I am particularly interested in how you avoid groupthink and the adverse influence of power structures, where the inclination is always to accede to the person in the level above you in the hierarchy. How embedded are those behavioural insights, and how well trained and kept up to speed are the people who use them?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Effective Scottish Government Decision Making

Meeting date: 18 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

Thank you.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Effective Scottish Government Decision Making

Meeting date: 18 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

I am referring to the pool of people whom we consult for external evidence.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Effective Scottish Government Decision Making

Meeting date: 18 April 2023

Michelle Thomson

That leads on to my last question about culture. Culture is a kind of summing up of a whole bunch of behaviours. When you were developing your methodology in 2020, did you step back and actively look at the culture of how you deliver change? Did you compare it with other countries? What findings remain constant a few years down the track?