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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 6 January 2025
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Displaying 1357 contributions

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Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

I apologise, Sue. That is why I was wondering why you were passing that question to David Eiser.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

Good morning. What do you think is the first thing that I noticed about you when you first came into the room this morning?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

Yes, you are all men. Off the back of that, I thought that I would just check how representative the organisation is. We can see that 20 per cent of the people here today are women—Susan Bomphray is online and has not had a chance to speak yet. I looked at the board, and I see that there is 25 per cent representation by women. Then I looked at the membership of the committees and saw that the risk and audit committee, which is the most active one, is 70 per cent men. Then I searched your strategy for the terms “sex”, “gender”, “women” and so on, and there was no mention of them. I also looked at your work plan, which has three mentions in passing. So my question is: are you completely or just mostly gender blind?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

I thought that you were director of policy, Susan. I see that your title on screen is “director of policy”.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

There is certainly much further to go.

Before I move on to my main area of questioning, I want to ask about your research—David Eiser may be able to come in on this. What consideration have you given thus far to how specifically your research in whatever area you are focusing on will make sure that it pulls in the unique insights of women? I take it that you are routinely disaggregating your data set by gender. I see nodding; it is heartening to know that you are doing that as a matter of routine.

I have a few questions about how your approach differs for small businesses, to which, I know, you offer a service. In some respects, the issues that are experienced by small business owners are similar to those experienced by other consumers. We have already touched on some of those today. What is more interesting is where small business owners are considered to be equal to large organisations but do not have the same power. I am thinking of issues to do with commercial contracts in financial banking, where a microbusiness is considered in law to have the same weight as NatWest. What are the similarities in the service that you offer to small businesses, and where are some of the advocacy differences?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

I want to confirm my understanding before we move off this point. You have a consumer-first approach, and then you think about where the linkages are that bring in similar issues for small businesses. That is how small businesses are brought in, rather than it being the other way around. Have I got that right?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

My last point, convener, is to ask whether Consumer Scotland has consulted two further bodies. Have you consulted the Financial Ombudsman Service for small and medium-sized enterprises? Although it was largely considered not to have done a great job in representing SMEs against the power of the banks, it should still be consulted. The other body that it might be useful to consult is Women’s Enterprise Scotland, which has a unique data set of the challenges that women in business and women generally face.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Consumer Scotland

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

Thank you for that, both of you.

Susan, I will stay with you for the time being. Given that, often, women are the most vulnerable of a variety of groups—we talked about vulnerable consumers—which specific women’s organisations have you consulted to get those unique insights? What specific policies have you developed to make sure that you target 51 per cent of the population effectively? Could you talk me through those questions?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 23 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

Do you have a comment, Professor Connolly?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Public Service Reform Programme

Meeting date: 23 May 2023

Michelle Thomson

I have a final comment, convener. I know that I still have some time.

John Connolly mentioned culture and innovation. There is a tendency with some people to think that reform of the public sector means having less of it but with the same structure, culture and behaviours. You distinctly made that comment about innovation. At a change level, it is extraordinarily difficult in any organisation to change culture and empower people. Do you have final thoughts about how you would go about that? It is quite a challenge.