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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 21 April 2025
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Displaying 1495 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 12 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

I am sorry to interrupt but, in that case, how could you be clear in your earlier statement to Willie Rennie, when you said that you did not think that that was likely? I am sorry, but I forget the exact words that you used.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 12 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

That is exactly what I would expect to happen. The reason why I may appear slightly startled about that is that there have been dire warnings from elsewhere in the UK, particularly from former UK Government ministers, for example, who are proclaiming that, in their opinion, it is likely that some institutions may fail in England. I presume that those institutions are taking the same mitigation steps as other institutions. That therefore begs the question: in your opinion, what is different in Scotland from what is happening elsewhere in the UK, where that is considered to be a higher probability? I am not clear about that.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 12 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

You have given us a lot of content, which other members will pick up on.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 12 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

As public sector institutions.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 12 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

Where is that set, then? Is that set in articles of association?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

Mark, do you have any final comments?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

Good morning. I want to talk about infrastructure. We have had a few considerations around that and Audit Scotland referred to it in a recent report. The Scottish Funding Council recently updated its own plans. We had hoped that the Scottish Government would be able to provide an updated infrastructure investment plan, but that has been delayed by the UK civil service because of the UK general election, so the picture is slightly different. We also know that the cuts to capital expenditure over the next five years are forecast to be 20 per cent in real terms. Mark MacPherson, I know that your report referenced the increase in capital expenditure by the Scottish Government that we have evidence of in recent years, such as year-end 2022-23 and year-end 2023-24.

Given that picture, I would like to hear your reflections on where we are with the real need to deliver a sustainable college estate. I will come to you first, Mark MacPherson.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

Thank you. I think that we will come on to that.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

You alluded to that earlier, and I know that we have danced around the issue.

This is my last question. I appreciate that Mary Senior and Ellie Gomersall might want to come in on my previous question as well. Our discussions today have been nearside with regard to what is happening in the UK and the differences in Scotland, but the issue of how to fund higher education is not unique to here. Many other countries have wrestled with issues such as how to incentivise international students and retain domestic students while maintaining fairness, parity and so on. To what extent is this discussion being forced over the longer term by the UK Government’s decision to introduce a fees system that is different from the Scottish Government’s system? As Ellie Gomersall pointed out, we have arrived at a certain position in Scotland.

I know that we might not want to start from where we currently are. Nonetheless, if we were looking internationally at other funding models, which ones might we consider? The UK—or, rather, England, with its tuition fees—is anomalous relative to what other countries do. In a multitude of other countries, for example, international students can study free of charge.

I am interested in hearing from Dr Conlon, in particular, because of your background. If we were not starting from here, what might we be able to do? I am quite concerned that we are looking just at the recent history and development.

I have asked Dr Conlon to comment, but I appreciate that the others will want to come in. I will bring you in, too.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

I appreciate that this has already been quite a wide-ranging discussion, but I want to offer Ellie Gomersall and Mary Senior the chance to come in, too. Ellie Gomersall, you might have some reflections on the international aspect, due to your role.

12:00